I was just on the Torque Report looking at some old postings and saw one on there about the "Smart Car". This car is probably smaller than a Mini Cooper and they are trying to get people in this country to buy it in masses. I looked up the MPG on this car and it surprised me: (from smart car website)

The vehicle is designed to achieve 40 city/45 highway mpg according to 2007 EPA standards and 33 city/41 highway mpg according to 2008 EPA standards. The mpg rating for all vehicles will decrease in 2008 due to new calculation methods that the EPA has adopted.

Now I don't know about you but for the "savings in fuel" I would rather buy something else like a civic and have a little more room to live.
What do you think? I tried to put a picture up for everyone but for some reason the site would not let me.

I pretty much agree, especially since there are at least a couple of those cars that will come close to or equal the Smart's fuel economy numbers. Read Edmunds' reviews, long term blogs, and user feedback about real-world Smart experiences and all the tradeoffs you get to have to own such a 'cute' city car.

Actually a month ago I saw a Smart Two in a parking lot at my local supermarket. It is painfully small, only two seats and very limited room in the back. I was fairly sure it was from New York and I said to myself, these must be brave people to take this deathtrap on the highway. What I failed to realize, and what others fail to realize is this vehicle wasn't designed for amazing fuel economy, but it was made for crowded European cities where parking is sparse and streets are tight. It's small for lack of space, not small for fuel economy. This vehicle should get much better fuel economy for it's size.

If people are looking for fuel economy they should consider a Ford Focus or Honda Civic, they are much more roomier than a Smart and get stellar fuel economy.

The smart ForTwo was never developed to be a fuel saver, but rather a small compact car that could easily fit into parking spaces in Europe. That's something that a lot of people don't know, and they're shocked to hear that it doesn't get amazing fuel economy. Personally, I think it's pretty ugly and too small for my tastes.

I've seen a couple of smarts around. One at the Sams club and my wife and I walked over to take a look and it was plastered with Obama 08 and Bush lied/sucks bumper stickers. Since the guy was standing there we just walked on by.

Not that there is anything wrong with Obama I just don't like to deal with Cool-Aid drikers form either side.

Were you impressed with the car?? What was your initial take on it .. is it bigger in person than it appears in print?

Were you impressed with the car?? What was your initial take on it .. is it bigger in person than it appears in print?

I wouldn't pay 12k+ for one but if it stickered around 6-7k I would take a look. I didn't find it impressive at all.

Nope...not impressive whatsoever. Quite overrated really. I don't have any desire for one at any price.
And even though the crash tests were good, I still don't trust that thing any farther than I can throw it.
As for the Obama stickers...well, if this is anything like GMI, I don't want to get banned...sooo...I'll restrain myself from ranting about that idiot.

I've seen a couple of smarts around. One at the Sams club and my wife and I walked over to take a look and it was plastered with Obama 08 and Bush lied/sucks bumper stickers. Since the guy was standing there we just walked on by.

Not that there is anything wrong with Obama I just don't like to deal with Cool-Aid drikers form either side.

Based on the car this person was driving and his bumper sticker he must be a liberal. This car is such a waste of money, only a sucker would buy one. Cars like the Civic and Focus can get the same fuel economy, while offering so much more room.

Yes, I would not mind having an older model Civic just to get around in, but the prices seem to have gone sky high since the gas crunch.

Yes, I would not mind having an older model Civic just to get around in, but the prices seem to have gone sky high since the gas crunch.

Or even a used Saturn, the older ones are very cheap but get amazing fuel economy.

http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2007/12/17/smart-car_7217.jpg
*picture from google images

I see them almost daily in phoenix.

Based on the car this person was driving and his bumper sticker he must be a liberal. This car is such a waste of money, only a sucker would buy one. Cars like the Civic and Focus can get the same fuel economy, while offering so much more room.

I agree but, if they sold new for 6-7k I would give up the room for it. IMO it would be a better alternative to buying a motorcycle and you could use it every day. As a daily driver I don't need much room but it would be a commuter car and nothing more. I definatly would not be using at a political statement just cheap transportation.

IMO, the ultimate commuter car is the 2010 Chevy Volt. 40 miles, no gas, just pure electricity. Enough to get the average commuter to work and back.

How much is it and how much will your electricity bill go up per year based on 12K per year?

Current estimates for the Volt are $40k, but we're expecting federal tax rebates to bring it down to $33k or so. We aren't sure how much your electricity bill will go up, but it will be charged at an off-peak time, during the night. However, we're fairly sure that it will end up saving you money without having to pay for gas.

I agree but, if they sold new for 6-7k I would give up the room for it. IMO it would be a better alternative to buying a motorcycle and you could use it every day. As a daily driver I don't need much room but it would be a commuter car and nothing more. I definatly would not be using at a political statement just cheap transportation.

I can get a used car for the same price. Plus it will be safe, as fuel efficient, and roomier than a Smart.

Current estimates for the Volt are $40k, but we're expecting federal tax rebates to bring it down to $33k or so. We aren't sure how much your electricity bill will go up, but it will be charged at an off-peak time, during the night. However, we're fairly sure that it will end up saving you money without having to pay for gas.

You know how to make money back on a Volt? Just drive it until the wheels come off. If the Volt gets a $7k government rebate it will only cost $5k more than a fully loaded Malibu. However, this car will get superior fuel economy, and run 40 miles without fuel. Fuel prices are going up every day, the time it will take to make your money back on the Volt will be minimal at this rate.

I can get a used car for the same price. Plus it will be safe, as fuel efficient, and roomier than a Smart.

All I'm saying is, for 6-7k I'd give it a look see not saying I'd buy.

All I'm saying is, for 6-7k I'd give it a look see not saying I'd buy.

No harm in looking, but I would be very critical of any car that cost that price new.

I think there is ALOT of anticipation for the VOLT - It will certainly revolutionize the Auto Industry and put OPEC on their A$$

Very much so. I figure that with my GMS pricing, I can get one for around $30k with federal tax rebate...might have to shuffle some funds around, but it may be worth it.

From the GM site: For someone who drives less than 40 miles a day, Chevy Volt will use zero gasoline and produce zero emissions.(2) For longer trips, Chevy Volt's range-extending power source kicks in to recharge the lithium-ion battery pack as required.
For the longer trips how far exactly can you go in this car?

From the GM site: For someone who drives less than 40 miles a day, Chevy Volt will use zero gasoline and produce zero emissions.(2) For longer trips, Chevy Volt's range-extending power source kicks in to recharge the lithium-ion battery pack as required.
For the longer trips how far exactly can you go in this car?

Funny you brought this up. GM announced today that they were reducing the reserve gas fuel tank in the Volt to save space and weight. It will now have a seven gallon tank as opposed to the original 12 gallon tank. The total range for the Volt will be brought down from 600 miles to around 360 miles.
It sounds bad, but consider that most Volt owners will only drive it to and from work. The majority will use the gas reserve supply only a few times a year.

This thread has pretty much been hijacked...but I have more Volt news. Apparently GM is now planning on releasing it early, perhaps in 2009 instead of the planned November 2010 launch date. This will help GM greatly as we expect that every Volt produced will be sold...and it'll get the Volt out on the streets before toyota can come up with something.

It will be interesting to see some test drives on this car. I would especially like to see some real time driving and get reports from “real” people who have taken it out on the road. There does seem to be a lot of interest in this car and it will be great if it takes off. I have some concerns with it being a totally new concept (past history aside especially with new technology) for GM. Perhaps we should add a separate forum for cars like this to discuss.

This thread has pretty much been hijacked...but I have more Volt news. Apparently GM is now planning on releasing it early, perhaps in 2009 instead of the planned November 2010 launch date. This will help GM greatly as we expect that every Volt produced will be sold...and it'll get the Volt out on the streets before toyota can come up with something.

You mean GM already got the Volt ready for production early?

You mean GM already got the Volt ready for production early?

We don't know that yet, but they were already planning on revealing the production-spec Volt at the Paris Auto Show this October, then the reveal was rumored to be moved up to the September celebration of GM's centennial birthday. So it SHOULD be ready for 2009, they're obviously working around the clock on the project.

We don't know that yet, but they were already planning on revealing the production-spec Volt at the Paris Auto Show this October, then the reveal was rumored to be moved up to the September celebration of GM's centennial birthday. So it SHOULD be ready for 2009, they're obviously working around the clock on the project.

That would be great, I just hope they don't rush it.

It will be interesting to see some test drives on this car. I would especially like to see some real time driving and get reports from “real” people who have taken it out on the road. There does seem to be a lot of interest in this car and it will be great if it takes off. I have some concerns with it being a totally new concept (past history aside especially with new technology) for GM. Perhaps we should add a separate forum for cars like this to discuss.

Yeah, it would be cool. Unfortunately, the only people allowed driving the prototypes are engineers and top GM executives. Bob Lutz did say that the ride was very smooth and quiet, handled just like a regular car, just ghostly quiet. Performance is sufficient, nothing like a Corvette ZR1, but it's enough to keep the driver satisfied. Luckily they tweaked the acceleration, the first prototypes took over 10 seconds to hit 60 MPH...:D
Incidentally, the test mules for the Volt are actually last-gen Malibus like mine...if anyone in Detroit sees a 5th-gen Malibu with a widebody kit and hood bulge, it's a Volt test mule.

Incidentally, the test mules for the Volt are actually last-gen Malibus like mine...if anyone in Detroit sees a 5th-gen Malibu with a widebody kit and hood bulge, it's a Volt test mule.

Does this mean the Volt will have the same interior room as the last generation Malibu? I know they are on different platforms, but I would like to get an idea of how big it will be on the inside.

Does this mean the Volt will have the same interior room as the last generation Malibu? I know they are on different platforms, but I would like to get an idea of how big it will be on the inside.

We haven't heard anything about interior room, but the Malibu test mules are only testing the battery/drivetrain systems of the Volt. I guess GM just had a few lying around.
I do know that the Volt is on the Delta-II platform, which is shared with the Chevrolet Cruze, the replacement for our current Cobalt. Here's some pictures of the supposed Cruze (not sure if that name will be the US Cobalt replacement, but we do know that the Cobalt name is dead).

A heavily camo-ed version...

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/2010_cobalt.jpg

And a much clearer version...

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/2010-Chevrolet-Cobalt.jpg

Since the Volt will be based off the same platform as the car shown above, it's a good indicator of how big it should be.

We haven't heard anything about interior room, but the Malibu test mules are only testing the battery/drivetrain systems of the Volt. I guess GM just had a few lying around.
I do know that the Volt is on the Delta-II platform, which is shared with the Chevrolet Cruze, the replacement for our current Cobalt. Here's some pictures of the supposed Cruze (not sure if that name will be the US Cobalt replacement, but we do know that the Cobalt name is dead).

A heavily camo-ed version...

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/2010_cobalt.jpg

And a much clearer version...

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/2010-Chevrolet-Cobalt.jpg

Since the Volt will be based off the same platform as the car shown above, it's a good indicator of how big it should be.

Not bad, but from what I heard GM is hitting the 40 mile mark on electric mode using the old Malibu bodies. Makes me wonder if GM is considering a E-Flex Malibu in the near term future? I would like that.

Not bad, but from what I heard GM is hitting the 40 mile mark on electric mode using the old Malibu bodies. Makes me wonder if GM is considering a E-Flex Malibu in the near term future? I would like that.

An E-Flex Malibu would be the best thing to hit GM since the Volt (which hasn't even arrived yet...:D). GM's primary family sedan is available with a no-gas option for 40 miles...man, I'd love to see the look on the toyota executives' faces when the camry's no longer the best selling car in America...:D :D :D

An E-Flex Malibu would be the best thing to hit GM since the Volt (which hasn't even arrived yet...:D). GM's primary family sedan is available with a no-gas option for 40 miles...man, I'd love to see the look on the toyota executives' faces when the camry's no longer the best selling car in America...:D :D :D

Yes exactly, I want to see GM put the E-Flex into larger vehicle. A larger E-Flex vehicle like a next generation Impala (Along with Malibu) is what I am thinking, something that gives plenty of room.

Don't even get me started on the next-gen Impala. There's a whole thread on GMI that's a few pages long about what we want it to look like, what we want inside it, what engines we want, what fuel economy we want to milk out of it...the current Impala, while a good car, just isn't up to standards with cars like the Avalon.

Don't even get me started on the next-gen Impala. There's a whole thread on GMI that's a few pages long about what we want it to look like, what we want inside it, what engines we want, what fuel economy we want to milk out of it...the current Impala, while a good car, just isn't up to standards with cars like the Avalon.

Yes I read that thread, it was interesting to say the least. It is a decent car but like you said the Impala isn't up to Avalon standards, IMO I think the Taurus is even a better vehicle than the current Impala. They just need to put the E-Flex into the largest car possible, so it can be useful for families.

Personally, I demand more before I will buy one of these vehicles. First and foremost, it would have to save me money right away. I would want a lower car payment and I would want a lower cost per mile. (no matter what it runs on) I don't see any point in lowering one bill to raise another. Next, the car itself would have to be built to run longer ranges, why stop if you don't have to. It would be nice to exchange stinky gas station stops on road trips with scenic stops to stretch the legs. Then, for me, it would have to be more versatile than a commuter because I drive more than just to commute and why should I buy one car to commute and another for when I want to actually go somewhere? I like to get out of the city and explore the mountains, lakes and rivers. I like to snowboard and take weekend trips to cool down from the phoenix heat in the summer. AWD or selectable 4wd, higher clearance and utility things like a roof rack and some good space to put my stuff. Its just not possible for a smart car to take me where I like to go. It sure won't carry the things I want to bring (like a canoe or even a large cooler) and if it can save me money like they have they potentially could, I'd be driving a lot more than flying so the space will be needed for luggage alone.

I like to get out of the city and explore the mountains, lakes and rivers. I like to snowboard and take weekend trips to cool down from the phoenix heat in the summer.
When did this become a "Dating Forum"? :eek::D Just kidding! :o

Personally, I demand more before I will buy one of these vehicles. First and foremost, it would have to save me money right away. I would want a lower car payment and I would want a lower cost per mile. (no matter what it runs on) I don't see any point in lowering one bill to raise another. Next, the car itself would have to be built to run longer ranges, why stop if you don't have to. It would be nice to exchange stinky gas station stops on road trips with scenic stops to stretch the legs. Then, for me, it would have to be more versatile than a commuter because I drive more than just to commute and why should I buy one car to commute and another for when I want to actually go somewhere? I like to get out of the city and explore the mountains, lakes and rivers. I like to snowboard and take weekend trips to cool down from the phoenix heat in the summer. AWD or selectable 4wd, higher clearance and utility things like a roof rack and some good space to put my stuff. Its just not possible for a smart car to take me where I like to go. It sure won't carry the things I want to bring (like a canoe or even a large cooler) and if it can save me money like they have they potentially could, I'd be driving a lot more than flying so the space will be needed for luggage alone.

Unfortunately, that's not what the Volt is designed for. It's meant to be a commuter vehicle, and GM's already started marketing it as one. The basic philosophy behind the Volt is that the consumer will drive it to work and back, plug it in upon arrival at home, then take another car out to go to the movies or run errands or whatever. It's not meant to be a leisure car or a road trip car. While I'm sure you'll achieve outstanding fuel economy if you took it on a road trip, it really was never meant for this purpose. In fact, when GM first decided to look into the Volt, one of the first studies they did was the average amount of mile driven to work and back.
Perhaps a vehicle like the 2010 Saturn Vue Plug-in Hybrid would better suit your needs. We've estimated it to achieve 40-50 MPG.

When did this become a "Dating Forum"? Just kidding! :o

lol, My fiance would be pretty angry if I jumped ship now,:eek: We're getting married this Saturday actually and next week She and I will be in Thailand! :p:D

Unfortunately, that's not what the Volt is designed for. It's meant to be a commuter vehicle, and GM's already started marketing it as one. The basic philosophy behind the Volt is that the consumer will drive it to work and back, plug it in upon arrival at home, then take another car out to go to the movies or run errands or whatever. It's not meant to be a leisure car or a road trip car. While I'm sure you'll achieve outstanding fuel economy if you took it on a road trip, it really was never meant for this purpose. In fact, when GM first decided to look into the Volt, one of the first studies they did was the average amount of mile driven to work and back.
Perhaps a vehicle like the 2010 Saturn Vue Plug-in Hybrid would better suit your needs. We've estimated it to achieve 40-50 MPG.

Send them back to the drawing board! Don't get me wrong, I like the idea, its just not for me. It might be cheaper to hire a daily driver than to own two cars and maybe the driver can buy the hybrid to save with their overheads. I like the sound of the 40-50mpg on the Vue, they'd need to give it a face lift though its a little too grocery getter for me. I need something a little more edgy and even more versital like the Wrangler. A hybrid that could compete and be just a versital as a wrangler would be perfect for me. Enough about me and my wants though no need to hijack this thread any further.

On another note, with getting married this weekend. I may have another outlook on this DD concept. My fiance drives more than I do everyday and a hybrid would be good for her, but again, unless it saves us money in total and doesn't just swap one bill for another, we won't buy it. With two drivers, two cars makes more sense and in that case I would be looking for something no smaller than a cobalt with a price tag no more than 15K and MPG of 60+.... At this point, I think I'm still dreaming.

Actually, you may be in luck in 2010. The replacement for the Cobalt, the Chevy Cruze, is supposed to get upwards of 40 MPG. About the same size as the Cobalt, on the Delta-II platform, and much better looking from what we've seen. Interior is beautiful as well...I'm considering one myself. The pictures I posted above are spy pics of it.

lol, My fiance would be pretty angry if I jumped ship now,:eek: We're getting married this Saturday actually and next week She and I will be in Thailand! :p:D

Congrats DTD, I wish you a lifetime of happiness! :D

Actually, you may be in luck in 2010. The replacement for the Cobalt, the Chevy Cruze, is supposed to get upwards of 40 MPG. About the same size as the Cobalt, on the Delta-II platform, and much better looking from what we've seen. Interior is beautiful as well...I'm considering one myself. The pictures I posted above are spy pics of it.
40? I know they can do better than that. When the time comes for a new car, I'll look into it. Thanks for the suggestion.

Congrats DTD, I wish you a lifetime of happiness! :D

Thanks

-Travis

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLVQtK04lig

Maybe I change my mind.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLVQtK04lig

Maybe I change my mind.....

Not gonna lie...looks like a go-cart with an upgraded engine...:p

Someone here just bought one and they thought they were
special enough that the paper put a page report about it.
He said that if he was parked next to a corvette that people
would not even look at the vette, and if it were parked
next to a Lambo it would get the same attention.:rolleyes:
Man someone thinks a lot of his car.

Someone here just bought one and they thought they were
special enough that the paper put a page report about it.
He said that if he was parked next to a corvette that people
would not even look at the vette, and if it were parked
next to a Lambo it would get the same attention.:rolleyes:
Man someone thinks a lot of his car.

BS.

Let's put his little dinky smartcar up against a 'Vette on a racetrack and see who gets all the attention now.

Oh what, smartcar driver? You're still getting up to speed? Oh. I've lapped the course three times now.
Corvette C6, Z06, and ZR1 > smartcar. Simple math.

I think that it is a stupid purchase, I would not want to
drive it in the winter with all the snow and ice we have here.
A race that would be funny smartcar 70hp, vette 430hp
who will win :confused::rolleyes:

Someone here just bought one and they thought they were
special enough that the paper put a page report about it.
He said that if he was parked next to a corvette that people
would not even look at the vette, and if it were parked
next to a Lambo it would get the same attention.:rolleyes:
Man someone thinks a lot of his car.

That maybe true but it gets the attention because different not because people really like it. I bet you $100 bucks if you parked the smart next to a Vette and had someone standing there with the keys to both saying you can have either car the Smart will still be sitting there 5 minutes later.

That maybe true but it gets the attention because different not because people really like it. I bet you $100 bucks if you parked the smart next to a Vette and had someone standing there with the keys to both saying you can have either car the Smart will still be sitting there 5 minutes later.

Wouldn't take me five minutes. I'd take the 'Vette in a second.

That's a NO BRAINER!! Vette for sure! They may look at the smart car but then jump in the vette all the while thinking to themselves what a pos that was!!

What kind of nut job would pick a Smart over a Vette?

What kind of nut job would pick a Smart over a Vette?

Environazis and ecoterrorists.

Because, you know, the Corvette's made by GM, which also makes the Hummer H2, so therefore the Corvette's an evil, Earth-destroying, pollution-spewing, global warming, baby-eating monster. :rolleyes:

I hate eco-terrorists. With a burning, undying passion. :mad:

Does this mean the Volt will have the same interior room as the last generation Malibu? I know they are on different platforms, but I would like to get an idea of how big it will be on the inside.

Sorry to bring this thread back to life...

But recent events must be taken into consideration about the Volt.

An ABC special showed some details of the Volt, and a member over at GMI by the name of MonaroSS, a very talented photochopper, incorporated some of those details as well as his own knowledge of the Delta-II platform into this photochop.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/monaroSSsVolt.jpg

Because the Cruze and Volt share the same platform as well as body structure as shown by a recent wind tunnel test of a heavily camouflaged Volt, this may very well be what the production Volt will look like, if not very close.

Looks pretty sweet to me.

Sorry to bring this thread back to life...

But recent events must be taken into consideration about the Volt.

An ABC special showed some details of the Volt, and a member over at GMI by the name of MonaroSS, a very talented photochopper, incorporated some of those details as well as his own knowledge of the Delta-II platform into this photochop.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/monaroSSsVolt.jpg

Because the Cruze and Volt share the same platform as well as body structure as shown by a recent wind tunnel test of a heavily camouflaged Volt, this may very well be what the production Volt will look like, if not very close.

Yes, I saw this photo on GMI recently and thought the render made by Monaro was very good. Far better looking than the Prius, if GM gets the price right it should sell well.

Once again, bringing this thread back to life as production pictures of the 2010 Chevrolet Volt were just revealed!

Too bad there's people in front.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/2011ChevyVolt.jpg

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f13/revealed-chevy-volt-first-pics-68963/

An unobstructed view put together by fbodyrules on GMI...

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/Voltrender.jpg

Not bad. I wonder if it will come with the grey bottom edge detail. I like it. Any picture of the back?

Environazis and ecoterrorists.

Because, you know, the Corvette's made by GM, which also makes the Hummer H2, so therefore the Corvette's an evil, Earth-destroying, pollution-spewing, global warming, baby-eating monster. :rolleyes:

I hate eco-terrorists. With a burning, undying passion. :mad:

Now Now that "burning, undying passion" is causing air pollution and unwanted carbon emissions....come on you should be a little more enviromentally friendly than that!

LOL :p LOL

Bean burritos cause pollution and noone has tried to ban THEM...

Bean burritos cause pollution and noone has tried to ban THEM...
They're banned in my house! :eek:;):D

Not bad. I wonder if it will come with the grey bottom edge detail. I like it. Any picture of the back?

Yup!

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l46/FenwickFalcon35/Voltrear.jpg

Smart Car VS Truck....

$20 said they didn't survive... YIKES...