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Old 08-14-2011, 02:58 PM   #1
96MN12
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Default 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

2008 Malibu LTZ 3.6L 46,000 miles Running Castrol Syntec 5W-30
I have oil getting into the air intake. In the past 5000 miles since an oil change, I've had to add 3 quarts of oil. The other day driving to Tucson on I-10 after about 70 miles or so of driving 80-90 mph, I was slowed down due to traffic (70mph) kicked it down to pass and a tremendous blue oil cloud came out of the exhaust. (Thought I was in an F16). All seemed to be normal, but same thing has happened again when hitting full throttle at higher speeds. Today, I changed the oil and noticed a huge amount of oil in the air intake tube. Probably 6 or 7 oz. Looks like the only place it could get in is thru the PCV. Has anybody else seen this?
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Old 08-14-2011, 03:19 PM   #2
greenman
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

Quote:
Originally Posted by 96MN12 View Post
2008 Malibu LTZ 3.6L 46,000 miles Running Castrol Syntec 5W-30
I have oil getting into the air intake. In the past 5000 miles since an oil change, I've had to add 3 quarts of oil. The other day driving to Tucson on I-10 after about 70 miles or so of driving 80-90 mph, I was slowed down due to traffic (70mph) kicked it down to pass and a tremendous blue oil cloud came out of the exhaust. (Thought I was in an F16). All seemed to be normal, but same thing has happened again when hitting full throttle at higher speeds. Today, I changed the oil and noticed a huge amount of oil in the air intake tube. Probably 6 or 7 oz. Looks like the only place it could get in is thru the PCV. Has anybody else seen this?
Your PCV valve is plugged up. Change it & clean the intake & throttle body as best you can.

Last edited by greenman; 08-14-2011 at 03:23 PM.
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Old 08-14-2011, 03:52 PM   #3
Rodents
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

These engines a fixed orifice PCV system. This bulletin fits your description well. You're well within powertrain warranty from what I see. Good luck.


#PIP4439A: HFV6 Oil Consumption - (Jun 20, 2011)


Subject: HFV6 Oil Consumption


Models: 2004-2007 Buick Rendezvous,

2005-2009 Buick Lacrosse, Allure

2008-2009 Buick Enclave

2004-2009 Cadillac CTS, STS, SRX

2008-2009 Chevrolet Malibu, Equinox

2007-2009 GMC Acadia

2007-2009 Pontiac G6

2008-2009 Pontiac G8, Torrent

2007-2009 Saturn Aura, Outlook

2008-2009 Saturn Vue

with LP1 2.8L, LY7 3.6L, or LLT 3.6L V6 engine




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This PI was superseded to update model years. Please discard PIP4439.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.

Condition/Concern:
Some customers may comment of excess engine oil consumption with no external leaks.

Recommendation/Instructions:
Verify the oil consumption concern following bulletin 01-06-01-011D.

In addition, check the engine air filter and replace the air filter element as necessary. Care must be taken to ensure that the air filter and air filter box are reassembled correctly so that the filter and air box seal and prevent foreign particles from bypassing the filter. Check for signs of foreign particles bypassing the filter and getting into the engine, such as dust or dirt in the air intake duct or on the throttle body. If dust or dirt is found, look for the source of the leak, such as incorrectly assembled air filter/air filter box, loose clamps or incorrectly assembled joints at the air duct, leaking sensor gaskets, damaged duct parts, etc. and correct as necessary.

If oil consumption is in excess of the guidelines in bulletin 01-06-01-011D, replace the piston rings and valve seals.
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Old 08-14-2011, 05:03 PM   #4
greenman
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

Rodents is absolutely correct: the PCV system is a valve-less design on that engine. My bad.

On the 3.6l you should check for a clogged fixed orifice. There is a really good section in the Chilton for the Pontiac G6 2005-09 on the PCV system that will tell you how. The book is well worth having for Malibu owners as so much of the car is the same.

We are still waiting on the new Chilton for Malibu gen 7.

Last edited by greenman; 08-14-2011 at 05:29 PM.
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Old 08-14-2011, 05:50 PM   #5
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

I'd be anxious to see the pistons in 96MN12's motor. I would believe you'd see carbon buildup on the rings not allowing them to seal properly. What OCI are you using? I've seen this bulletin for while but never had a car to use it on. If the PCV passage is blocked already, I'd be surprised. Not saying it can't happen but GM must have seen a pattern to say valve seals and piston rings.
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Old 08-14-2011, 07:29 PM   #6
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodents View Post
I'd be anxious to see the pistons in 96MN12's motor. I would believe you'd see carbon buildup on the rings not allowing them to seal properly. What OCI are you using? I've seen this bulletin for while but never had a car to use it on. If the PCV passage is blocked already, I'd be surprised. Not saying it can't happen but GM must have seen a pattern to say valve seals and piston rings.
It could well be an excessive blow-by issue. But I look at his engine mileage & it gives me pause. That's all I had in mind. OCI?
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Old 08-14-2011, 07:45 PM   #7
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

OCI. Oil Change Interval. I'm not a fan of the oil life monitor sytem. I'm a dealer tech and there are way too many engines coming in with stuck rings. SOMETHING isn't right. Is it the oil, the filter, some other contributing factor, too long between changes? I blame it on too long of a change interval. There are A LOT of people in forums anywhere I look that are relying big time on UOA (used oil analysis) and synthetic oil for long, long change intervals. I'm using Pennzoil Ultra and a NAPA Platinum filter, I'll change my oil twice a year. If I put 5 or 6 K a year on the odometer, that's still way ahead of the OLM system. Could I go longer, yeah sure. Could I run Regular oil, yeah sure. I'm on the way too conservative side, some people are just as far though on the other side and I'm wondering if this could be the case here. That's why I asked what his OCI was. I'm curious how this plays out. I've seen quite a few 3.6's with oil in the intake tube but not in the quantity 96MN12 is reporting. The V8's in the trucks have lots of issues with stuck rings at low mileage. Two in our shop just last week for pistons, both were all carboned up. The 3.6 timing chain issue is another possibly oil change interval related issue. The General has made calibrations available for revising the max oil life from 10K to 5K for timing chain wear issues. This includes Cadillac which specs out Mobil1 for use. I've drawn my conclusions based on what I see, you draw your own conclusions. I could be eating crow some day.
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Old 08-15-2011, 12:56 AM   #8
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

I did some research on the LY7 engine & they seem to have two notable problems: noisy timing chains & high oil consumption due to worn rings. Also saw some with oil leaking past the valves.

To the OP: Don't clean that intake take it to the dealer as is. He'll need to see that oil puddle.

Last edited by greenman; 08-15-2011 at 01:06 AM.
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Old 08-15-2011, 05:25 AM   #9
96MN12
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

Where can I find a copy of the "PIP4439A: HFV6 Oil Consumption - (Jun 20, 2011)" and "bulletin 01-06-01-011D" ? I have found that I need to lead the Chevy dealer to the fix on most problems I've had with this car!! Oil was changed every 4-5 K by the dealer as part of their purchase of the car. After 36K I; changed it myself using Syntech 5W-30. Air filter was replaced about 5K ago. Since synthetic oil is thinner than regular oil could this contribute to the poor design of the PCV allowing oil to get past it?
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Old 08-15-2011, 07:15 AM   #10
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Default Re: 3.6 L Oil in Air Intake

PIP 4439A is already in this thread in post #3. At the end of this post I'll put 01-06-01-011D. I don't know where you got the idea the PCV system was a poor design but it's your opinion so it works for me. It's a well known issue with these motors that the timing chains have durability issues, the primary timing chain guides have been wiped out in every one I've ever done. The reduced OLM system max interval is one angle at addressing it but I would believe there's more to it than that. If they go as far as replacing seals and rings, ask to see the pistons when they come out. There's no reason you can't see them. GM has no rule that says the customer can't see the parts we've replaced, just under warranty you can't keep them as they do get called back for analysis from time to time. There may be a separate issue with the rings and valve seals but if there's carbon build up on the rings, I'll lay first blame on too long of an OCI for the driving conditions encountered. The worst synthetic oil could do is expose a leak somewhere, it should not cause any other issues. You'll see the bulletin below has the letter F behind it. That is the latest version of the bulletin you asked for. The letters at the end increment through the alphabet as revisions are made to the bulletin. It is applicable to all models years as far as I know, disregard the '09 and prior at the top. If you have more questions, let me know.
Next post will have the bulletin, too long for the system.
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